Tournament videoguides and raw tournament footage

[-Kirby-]

Hello everyone!
For the past few months I’ve been working on a variety of videoguides for tournaments. It is my hope that people who see my strategies laid out before their eyes may adapt them to their play for the betterment of their skills and the competition as a whole.

These guides are intended to show my thought process during tournaments through the use of YouTube’s annotations. While they were, of course, annotated after the tournaments (sometimes way, way after), you’ll notice that I often try to be “in character” so that the ride feels more spontaneous and interesting for the audience. For the most part I want those who watch (especially players that are trying to learn) to experience the videos the way I experienced the actual tournaments; so for example I end up using the word “we” instead of “I” a lot, trying to immerse the viewer in the video.

The annotations are full of tips, strategies, and general commentary that are intended to give players some more insight into aspects of tournaments they may not think about very much; things like equipment management and the importance of knowing who you’re up against become discussed topics. There's gotta be something like 100 annotations per video.

While they are intended for an audience of players that isn’t very experienced, I think experienced players might find some of them enjoyable too; although if you’re one of these players you should be aware that having basic tips displayed on your screen over and over can get annoying.

I would like some feedback on them from whoever watches them; do you have enough time to read the annotations before they disappear? Are they in the way? Do they linger for an annoyingly long amount of time? I want to make these as nice as possible so that others will be willing to watch them to improve their skills. YouTube’s annotation feature is actually very annoying to work with. The annotations end up looking very different on the final video than they do while you’re building them, so you end up having to make many adjustments.

Here are the guides:

1: Nazz, Foundry, 11-17-13
HD: Yes
Level: Intermediate
Focus: Equipment Management
Other topics:
-Foundry and dry land maps in general
-Experimentation
-Maximizing points & equipment hauls in small fights
-Dealing with a late equipment crisis
Description: This is a tournament I went into with the intent to experiment with equipment management. I intentionally took more risks and stretched my equipment thinner than I normally would, just because I hadn’t done so in a while and wanted to see what would happen. While I did ultimately win gold, it didn’t come without an equipment crisis at the end; one that I believe would normally send a player back a few spots.

2: dolphin, Levels, 12-8-13
HD: Yes
Level: Intermediate
Focus: Dealing with Death in a Tournament
Other topics:
-Levels in general
-Why the other players on your color matter to you
-What to do with homing shots
-Judging points gaps
-When you should and shouldn’t give up
-Believing in yourself
Description: This is a relatively crowded Levels tournament in which an uncanny number of top flight players experienced early deaths. I also ended up experiencing an early death. I reasoned, however, that I wasn’t going to give up until I was sure I was out of contention… and the events that happened down the stretch ended up being pretty amazing. I won’t spoil it.

3: Open Window, Appaloosa Land, 10-24-13
HD: Yes
Level: Intermediate
Focus: The Importance of Getting Points
Other topics:
-Apps in general & playing land in a water-heavy map
-When to look for kills (and when not to)
-Stashing a ferry for later
-Equipment locations, wetness/dryness, management in general
Description: A relatively un-crowded Apps tournament in which the map’s equipment shortages made things a struggle. There wasn’t a ferry in the entire Pacific Ocean. However due to sound equipment management we were able to make the most of it and do everything but land a kill.

4: PALM TREE in SEATTLE, Crazy Maze, 11-23-13
HD: Yes
Level: Advanced
Focus: Anticipation and Timing in Fights
Other topics:
-Maze in general
-Minimizing small mistakes
-Predicting opponent moves
-Timing when exactly to map
-How to optimize bot shooting
-Identifying a targeted die-down as such
Description: A Maze tournament in which I got top points after an 11-minute fill. The guide focuses on revealing all the little things I did that helped maximize my points in battle - as well as all the little things I did that kept me from doing even better – by scoring each good/bad moment with points. I didn’t play this tournament with the intent to grade it so harshly, but considering everything that could’ve been done better I left a lot of points on the table. Definitely the most unique guide.

5: Starmie, Desert, 6-1-13
HD: Yes, but slightly distorted. I recommend 360p or 480p.
Level: Beginner
Focus: The Basics.
-Filling at the beginning
-Identifying potential kills
-Using land features & angle shots
-Optimally stalking a corporal
Description: This guide actually isn’t very revealing, and honestly I wasn’t even very good at tournaments when I created it. Nonetheless, it’s made to be more entertaining to newbies and give them an idea of what kinds of decisions they should be making in a tournament.

6: Usami Sadayuki, Desert, 6-22-13
HD: Yes, but slightly distorted. I recommend 360p or 480p.
Level: Very beginner
Focus: Turning Luck into a Cup
Description: Another “guide” from when I wasn’t as great at tournaments. This one is probably the most entertaining for a newbie to watch, as literally everything goes my way in it. The annotations are more about keeping the newbie engaged with the video so that they can learn by watching in the first place than by loading them with information. There is lots of information in there however.

If you just want to watch a couple to be entertained, I suggest that numbers 1 and 2 (Nazz and dolphin) might be the most entertaining / well-done. I feel like those both have some insightful commentary and feature some relatively unique situations that make them more interesting than the rest. I did numbers 5 and 6 a long time ago so admittedly, they're probably worse in every regard (though still useful to anyone just trying to learn). #4 also might be really entertaining, or not, I don't know to be honest. It's definitely different.


Here's some other raw footage you can watch. Some of them may be turned into guides later:
The Quiet White, Aquarium, 12-17-13
Clover, Rocks and Swamp, 12-15-13
Icy Tides, Crazy Waters, 12-14-13
OlivE JuicE, Desert, 11-1-13
Senai, Metropolis, 9-21-13
Lightning Dust, Appaloosa Land, 9-7-13
- Earth -, Elements, 9-1-13
Thumper, The Pit, 8-31-13

If there is popular demand for more guides, I'll make more. Newbies & everyone alike, let me know if you enjoy these and/or find them helpful; it will definitely help motivate me to do more if I know people are actually enjoying them and/or learning from them.

[The_Revelation]

...Kirby strikes again.

I am about to check out the videos. Nice work as usual.


Just watched a few - loved it. I like seeing other players approach in the first 15 minutes and last 10 minutes. These are the most important parts for me in a tournament. This is very informative and excellent for a new player and or a intermediate player looking to make that leap to a consistent cupping machine. In a game like Tankpit, the little things added up make the big difference.



LOVVVEEE ITT

[weekend_nachos]

[Dopatonin]

Just watched the Crazy Maze, palm tree one. Really enjoyed the annotations on grading your own performance.

[weekend_nachos]

I'll always be forever jealous of Kirbys insanely responsive internet

I would never get away with like 3/4ths of the moves he gets.

[goober]

the videos are awesome

[delivery]

Would love to see some water map guides. Otherwise, great work and very helpful.

Maybe consider speaking and commenting? Might save you some time with annotations.

[Dopatonin]

Kirby, what do you use to record?

I need to grace the community with my amazing equipment filling techniques, then disappoint them with my substandard tournament play.

[goober]

quick question, what are the pp values for shooting duals at a recruit vs private vs corp vs serg vs lt vs cap? I used to know, but in your videos you would shoot a recruit no problem. I'm just curious if it'd be better to spent a little more time seeking out an corp bot. Obviously your strategy is a good one if you consistently get placed high.

[-Kirby-]

When it comes to getting points I subscribe to a very basic idea: that each and every turn should be used either to expend or accrue dual shots. The faster I can expend, the better; the faster I can pick up equipment, the better. Of course the faster I do that, the faster I will lose radars - a reason why I like to overstock them.

Considering the idea above, if I know I can fire into a nearby recruit bot 7 times, I will. I find that shooting bots also gives me time to contemplate my next sequence of moves and/or any other variables I need to gain more awareness of - and the more times I can do this, the more insight into the tournament I can gain.

The point values themselves have been hidden in TankPit, and have probably changed a few times too. I think it's better to not discriminate which bots you decide to shoot based on rank - staring at the map "looking" for something is just idle time.

[goober]

When it comes to getting points I subscribe to a very basic idea: that each and every turn should be used either to expend or accrue dual shots. The faster I can expend, the better; the faster I can pick up equipment, the better. Of course the faster I do that, the faster I will lose radars - a reason why I like to overstock them.

Considering the idea above, if I know I can fire into a nearby recruit bot 7 times, I will. I find that shooting bots also gives me time to contemplate my next sequence of moves and/or any other variables I need to gain more awareness of - and the more times I can do this, the more insight into the tournament I can gain.

The point values themselves have been hidden in TankPit, and have probably changed a few times too. I think it's better to not discriminate which bots you decide to shoot based on rank - staring at the map "looking" for something is just idle time.

word okay thanks for the response. maybe i'll try to figure out the difference and see for myself, but I'll give it a shot! i play for kills not pph, but i will try to play for pph occassionally and that might be beneficial.

[Dopatonin]

Honestly, this thread should probably be stickied IMO. We have guides stickied, and videos are usually infinitely better than guides, considering you get to see a completely objective perspective of how a tournament is played, with details that are usually unconsciously omitted from written guides.

New players would benefit tremendously from this.

[The_Revelation]

Stickies are earned by the communities consistent attention/interest in a thread. But this seems like sticky material.

[Dopatonin]

Stickies are earned by the communities consistent attention/interest in a thread. But this seems like sticky material.

No offense, but this thread has had three posts in it. Two in September, and one several months later, yet it is stickied.

viewtopic.php?f=170&t=17298

Maybe just make a thread of "Tournament Strategy" and copy all the relevant information with accredited details?

[Erock]

Great stuff kirby! I enjoyed the dolphin tourney the most out of the two i skimmed over; your ability to rally in that tournament was very impressive.

[Dopatonin]

Kirby, your -earth- tourney made me face palm so hard. I don't want to spoil it for anyone, but goddamn, use your armor shields!!

[The_Revelation]

Stickies are earned by the communities consistent attention/interest in a thread. But this seems like sticky material.

No offense, but this thread has had three posts in it. Two in September, and one several months later, yet it is stickied.

viewtopic.php?f=170&t=17298

Maybe just make a thread of "Tournament Strategy" and copy all the relevant information with accredited details?

That was made a sticky before I was mod of this section. But the idea was to gather information for noobs to help them improve. You are right that it does not have many views, so the idea probably needs more information or a slight rework - but these types of threads generally don't get tones of hits because many of the vets are not hooked to come back like other threads.

Thanks for your thoughts Dopa. We will likely see a "Guide" update in the future.

[Cdub]

Bump

[003]

Finally got around to watching the first video. Luckily, I knew most of the tips you presented but you can always learn something from someone. Great job with the annotations. You did a decent job keeping the Top 10 list in view. That's basically the scoreboard for video viewers and I remember some of the past people who recorded tournaments didn't show the top 10 very often.

I look forward to checking out your other videos. There's always more to learn!

Random thought, you fire using the mouse? How common is this? I always use spacebar. It just seems smoother and quicker somehow

[-Kirby-]

For me the mouse has always felt more secure & reliable. In both TankPit and Battlefield I somehow lose/lost turns if I'm merely holding the spacebar and the mouse is completely still over my opponent, as if the computer "forgets" that the spacebar is being held down and just stops firing. I don't think it's a game problem, I think it's just something that may happen to some computers but not others.

I know Icy and maybe 1-2 other people said that they too mash clicks over other tanks like I do but I think most people hold space.

[003]

Interesting. I actually don't do either. I mash space like you mash the clicks

[goober]

Kirby, your -earth- tourney made me face palm so hard. I don't want to spoil it for anyone, but goddamn, use your armor shields!!

SERIOUSLY!

[mz]

Regarding the mouse/spacebar.

The spacebar has a certain repeat rate that holds true for all buttons on the keyboard. When you hold it down, the computer understands it as

Fire
Wait
Wait
Wait
Fire
Wait
Wait
Wait
Fire

You can reset the repeat rate to make the wait time between fires smaller. However, on my computer even the minimum wait time is larger than how fast I can click so clicking is still faster.

[mtp1200]

For me the mouse has always felt more secure & reliable. In both TankPit and Battlefield I somehow lose/lost turns if I'm merely holding the spacebar and the mouse is completely still over my opponent, as if the computer "forgets" that the spacebar is being held down and just stops firing. I don't think it's a game problem, I think it's just something that may happen to some computers but not others.

I know Icy and maybe 1-2 other people said that they too mash clicks over other tanks like I do but I think most people hold space.

tried the spam clicking rather then space bar today seemed to freeze a bit on the hit when clicking, like the animation or whatever

[The_Revelation]

Just watched another one. I love the annonations so much! You do great work for these forums kirby!

[LastSingularity]

Kirby - thanks to your videos, my equipment management got much better.

I used to run into equipment crises all the time, either: 1 - searching for equipment in spots / times right after others had refilled, or 2 - running out of ER's in the last 10-15 min, dropping 3-4 ranks while I try to refill, and flipping a shit. Never made it past 8th or 9th

Ever since I've been filling to 76-all at corporal, or more often 84-84-84-84-80+ as sergeant, I never had an equipment crisis again on normal maps like desert / castles / foundry / the pit / R&S. Most of the times, once I fill my ER past 80 as sergeant, there are only 45 min or less remaining anyway, so that is sufficient for the rest of the tourney! It's very genius, very "counter-cyclical" (as sean/987 phrases it), because I am filling up my ER's when the 1st spawn hasn't been used up yet, and then I am PPH'ing while others who used up their 60 duals from recruit start to refill, and then when I am out of duals, the 2nd equipment spawn just generated. I cannot believe I never thought of it before

Because of your guides, I have gotten closer to cupping than ever before:
4th Captain - http://tankpit.com/tournament_results/?tid=275
6th Captain - http://tankpit.com/tournament_results/?tid=278
6th Captain - http://tankpit.com/tournament_results/?tid=286

Thanks so much Kirby.

[-LanceheaD-]

This is golden stuff kirby! I never really looked at it, but was curious how fellow tournament players achieve their success. Much of the basic principles you use are the same ones I use when I play. Very interesting strategy though filling at corporal and stuff. I only saw one video (Palm tree) and kind of jumped around but it is very cool to me that other people have found large success in slightly different ways.

Btw, lastsingularity ^, have equipment spawns periodically through the tourney been proven? Or.. has SW confirmed this? The way I play, I pay no attention to equipment spawns and I still do very well. My theory is that equipment spawns do not occur in a periodic fashion but that each equipment respawns somewhere in the field once it is taken. I believe the scarcity of equipment in a tournament at times is due to people collecting equipment at "equipment hot spots" and people collectively missing certain new "respawned equip hot spots". It is more of a distribution imbalance due to people's actions and propensity to collect equipment in certain areas and not others. And I may be completely wrong about this so dont quote me on it. I just never found solid proof to believe in like entire field equipment spawns periodically throughout a tourney

Nonetheless, fantastic guides. I may look into at least recording a tourney... what do you guys use to record? and which online cam has the lowest game lag impact?

[LastSingularity]

This is golden stuff kirby! I never really looked at it, but was curious how fellow tournament players achieve their success. Much of the basic principles you use are the same ones I use when I play. Very interesting strategy though filling at corporal and stuff. I only saw one video (Palm tree) and kind of jumped around but it is very cool to me that other people have found large success in slightly different ways.

Btw, lastsingularity ^, have equipment spawns periodically through the tourney been proven? Or.. has SW confirmed this? The way I play, I pay no attention to equipment spawns and I still do very well. My theory is that equipment spawns do not occur in a periodic fashion but that each equipment respawns somewhere in the field once it is taken. I believe the scarcity of equipment in a tournament at times is due to people collecting equipment at "equipment hot spots" and people collectively missing certain new "respawned equip hot spots". It is more of a distribution imbalance due to people's actions and propensity to collect equipment in certain areas and not others. And I may be completely wrong about this so dont quote me on it. I just never found solid proof to believe in like entire field equipment spawns periodically throughout a tourney

Nonetheless, fantastic guides. I may look into at least recording a tourney... what do you guys use to record? and which online cam has the lowest game lag impact?

Regardless of how equipment spawns (whether constantly / continuously, or in lumps every 20-30 min), sean/987's concept of "counter-cyclicality" makes a lot of sense, either way. You want to pick up equipment just before other guys empty out their duals (say most of the map is down to 20-30 dual shots). Then in 5 min, you want to be PPH'ing / beasting duals with another guy who also has 80+ duals, while the other 90% of the map is refilling (and won't find as much equipment because you already mopped up 5-6 screens of equipment just 5 min ago).

Kirby illustrates this very vividly here in his Nov 17th tourney in Foundry, at 25 min in, where he notices that the PPH mob is slowly drifting from top right of the map, downward, towards middle right of the map. He front-runs them, by sweeping the 1-2 screens in front of the fight, for equipment, so that he maximizes his fills, and minimizes theirs:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5TO6ILzDFNE

Other way to think of it is - conversely - would you rather be refilling your equipment 2 min after 60%+ of the map has just filled?

I don't really care how equipment spawns if I can just cup, but if I cannot in the next few tourneys, I might do some in-depth analysis into how equipment spawns. Like, go into a tourney, and just sit in a corner of the map (4-5 screens), and radar the area for equipment every 1-2 min, to see when new equipment appears. If there is nothing, nothing, nothing, for 10 min straight, and then BAM, there appear 4-5 boxes, then it's a "gap / lump spawn." If it's like, one box appears every 2-3 min, and it drips in constantly, then it's a "continuous spawn"

I don't really believe that equipment spawns more just because people used it up. There were a good 5 min in the Iceland 2-hour tourney disaster, where I sampled different areas of the map (upper right, lower left, center, etc) and I couldn't find ANYTHING. This leads me to believe that equipment spawns at pre-determined times (but in random locations)

Then again, what the hell do I know??? Just throwing some ideas to test out, maybe, for anyone who is more rigorous / analytic

[The_Revelation]

Thread title: Higher ranks earn more points in tournaments

Post by SW » Sat May 31, 2014 11:25 pm

This would change the dynamics so the common strategy nowadays "pph till the end then get FKs" would no longer be the most effective.

Another option would be to increase the fuel and EQ at the end instead of decreasing it, to make dying at the end less likely.

Based on this above statement, it leads me to believe that SW has a system in place that currently decreases EQ as the tournament progresses. At one time in BF, there were definite "drop times" but SW has eliminated the predictability of EQ now, so no one is currently aware of specific drop rates - but I do play a certain way based on my experience with EQ. I personally find that there is a plethora of EQ spawning for the first 20 minutes, then it usually struggles around the 25 - 40 minute marker. Then it levels out and there is less than the beginning, but usually a few per screen on average.

So 1 for 1 theory could be correct, but as the tournament progresses it could look something like this...

01 - 20 minutes : 1 box consumed - 1 box respawns

25 - 40 minutes : 2 boxes consumed - 1 box respawns

40 - 60 minutes : 1.5 boxes consumed - 1 box respawns

This above equation can not be the full equation, but it may be part of it. There would have to be more code to place initial EQ, and then "make up EQ" with some definite randomness. I think that SW has gone out of his way to make it very difficult to get a personal system in place for EQ. The other major factor is EQ sitting on dead water, this will for sure slow down respawn rates on ground placed EQ.

Lastly, I think that SW has been "tinkering" with the EQ system a bit over the past year or so. I think he will continue to do this until he finds the balance he is looking for.

[-LanceheaD-]

Very good rev. I like that theory of the 1 to 1 equip spawn with a decreasing ratio as the tournament progresses. Also, I do notice that there is a scarcity of equipment on average from like the 25-45 minute mark (somewhere in there). I guess no one really knows but SW, how it all works.

Last singularity, if you want to sit in a corner and do that I'm sure that would yield some answers. I would use er's to radar the screen all at once if i were you to make sure they spawned all at once on ur screen.

Its funny how complicated this tournament science shit can get on a 2d game. Still kind of blows me away how much one needs to know to strategize and be able to win tournies consistently. To the outside world, I'm just shooting tanks back and forth back and forth with spacebar, but it takes a lot more to win then pressing spacebar. Thats why I like this discussion haha.